http://www.orkut.co.in/Main#CommMsgs.aspx?cmm=214336&tid=2585146931582175946&kw=love
Answer: Loving your Guru in the hope of getting Self realisation is wrong. You should not want anything from the Guru except his love.Question: But isn't loving a Guru in the hope that he will love you in return just as bad as loving him because you think that he will give you self realisation?Answer: No. Wanting the Guru's love makes your own love increase. If you want the Guru's love you must make every effort to think of him all the time. You must try to give him more and more and more of your love. Anything that makes you love your Guru like this is good.It is not good to think about realisation as an event in the future. Such things cannot be predicted. One should only be concerned with stabilising oneself in the peace and bliss of the present. Thinking about the future and predicting one's future spiritual career are a waste of mental energy. Some people used to ask if I meditate for 3 years or so can we get realised. This is not like running a 3 year graduation course in Self realisation. :-)People who used to get everything they want think realisation can be had for a price. They think the price is 3 or 5 years of meditation. This attitude is not helpful.If you love one person more than the another this is not true love; it is an attachment created by desire. To love all things equally, seeing the Self in all of them, is True LOVE.
When the Self is realised, and sometimes even before, one can feel this love animating and flowing through the body in the same way that blood flows through the veins and arteries.It is love which binds the universe together and sustains it. Without love it would be nothing more than a collection of inert matter. It is the same with the human body; without love or the Self the body would just be an inert lump.All love is the same love, but love other than the love of God is a waste. When two people love each other and get married, what are they loving? They are loving each other's minds and bodies. If a man loved the self in his wife he would not grieve when her body dies because he would know that nothing has really happened to the Self. When two people marry and give all their love to each other they are building a wall around themselves. They have no love left for the God or the Self, and because of this they can never see and love the Self which is immanent in all things. Couples who only love each other can never realise the Self because they are preoccupied with their minds and bodies and have no love left for God. From a spiritual point of view the ideal man-woman relationship is one in which the couple live as brother and sister, and instead of wasting their love on each other, they give it all to God.
Monday, January 12, 2009
Need for a living spiritual Guru
http://www.orkut.co.in/Main#CommMsgs.aspx?cmm=214336&tid=2578005734556273354&kw=on+gurus
Guru: A living human Guru is essential for Self realisation. It is the Self, acting through the medium of the Guru, which finally destroys the ego, and only the human Guru can act as the medium. When the Guru gives up his body, the Self can no longer use him to destroy devotees' egos.Question: Ramana Maharshi realised the Self without any effort and without a Guru. How was this possible?Guru: He was a very advanced soul who had almost completed his sadhana in his previous lives.Question: If the Guru cannot provide help after his death, what is the devotee to do when the Guru gives up the body?Guru: If the devotee wants to realise the Self he should try to find another Guru who has realised the Self. Otherwise it will be extremely difficult.
Before elaborating on this rather contentious theme it will be instructive to read a brief exchange which took place between Ramana Maharshi (R) Yogi Ramaiah, one of his most respected devotees. The conversation took place in the late 1940s.Q: Some devotees of Shirdi Sai Baba worship a picture of him and say it is their Guru. How could that be? They can worship it as God, but what benefit could they get by worshipping it as their Guru?R: They secure concentration by that...Q:How can a lifeless picture help in developing deep concentration? It requires a living Guru who could show it in practise. It is possible for Bhagavan to attain perfection without a living Guru, but is it possible for people like myself?R: That is true. even so, by worshipping a lifeless portrait, the mind gets concentrated to a certain extent. That concentration will not remain constant unless one knows one's own Self by enquiring. For that enquiry, a Guru's help is necessary.
Sri Ramana's second answer contains three interesting points:1. Devotion to an image of a dead Guru is good for concentrating the mind, but no more.2. To know the Self, self-enquiry is required.3. A Guru's help is required to do self-enquiry properly. Since Sri Ramana has already stated in both answers that devotion to a dead Guru is only good for enhancing one's ability to concentrate, one must assume that when he says "a Guru's help is necessary" he means a living Guru. This reference is substantiatied by another part of the answer. When Yogi Ramaiah says, "It requires a living Guru who could show it in practise", Sri Ramana replies "That is true".The other Guru (devotee of Ramana) mentioned initially in the above message endorses all of three points and frequently mentions them in His talks. Of the three items, he attaches most imporatnce to the necessity of having a living Guru. Many of his questioners challenge his assertion that dead Gurus cannot bring one to a realisation of the Self. Because of this it will be helpful tp explain the reasoning behind his statements. The Guru, is not a person, he is the impersonal Self; he is the power of the Self manifesting through a human body, not the body itself or anything in it. while that body is alive the grace of the Self is channelled through it to the devotees. When the body dies the Self can no longer use it to transmit grace. After death the Guru remains as he always was, that is, the unmanifest and formless Self. Because the Guru has no form after death of the physical body, it is not then possible for a devotee to get his grace by concentrating on a picture or a mental image of him. This is because the 'him' no longer exists. As Sri Ramana says, such practices are only good for concentration.
If one concentrates on, and has devotion towrds, a dead Guru, then grace will come from the unmanifest Self (this too happens for matured Souls), and not from the form of the Guru. This grace can take one to an effortless thought free state, but it cannot pull tht mind into the Self and destroy it.The above messages clearly state the need for a living human Guru. The messages are not to offend anyone. It is only an awareness kind of stuff and messages from Ramana and his devotee.
Guru: A living human Guru is essential for Self realisation. It is the Self, acting through the medium of the Guru, which finally destroys the ego, and only the human Guru can act as the medium. When the Guru gives up his body, the Self can no longer use him to destroy devotees' egos.Question: Ramana Maharshi realised the Self without any effort and without a Guru. How was this possible?Guru: He was a very advanced soul who had almost completed his sadhana in his previous lives.Question: If the Guru cannot provide help after his death, what is the devotee to do when the Guru gives up the body?Guru: If the devotee wants to realise the Self he should try to find another Guru who has realised the Self. Otherwise it will be extremely difficult.
Before elaborating on this rather contentious theme it will be instructive to read a brief exchange which took place between Ramana Maharshi (R) Yogi Ramaiah, one of his most respected devotees. The conversation took place in the late 1940s.Q: Some devotees of Shirdi Sai Baba worship a picture of him and say it is their Guru. How could that be? They can worship it as God, but what benefit could they get by worshipping it as their Guru?R: They secure concentration by that...Q:How can a lifeless picture help in developing deep concentration? It requires a living Guru who could show it in practise. It is possible for Bhagavan to attain perfection without a living Guru, but is it possible for people like myself?R: That is true. even so, by worshipping a lifeless portrait, the mind gets concentrated to a certain extent. That concentration will not remain constant unless one knows one's own Self by enquiring. For that enquiry, a Guru's help is necessary.
Sri Ramana's second answer contains three interesting points:1. Devotion to an image of a dead Guru is good for concentrating the mind, but no more.2. To know the Self, self-enquiry is required.3. A Guru's help is required to do self-enquiry properly. Since Sri Ramana has already stated in both answers that devotion to a dead Guru is only good for enhancing one's ability to concentrate, one must assume that when he says "a Guru's help is necessary" he means a living Guru. This reference is substantiatied by another part of the answer. When Yogi Ramaiah says, "It requires a living Guru who could show it in practise", Sri Ramana replies "That is true".The other Guru (devotee of Ramana) mentioned initially in the above message endorses all of three points and frequently mentions them in His talks. Of the three items, he attaches most imporatnce to the necessity of having a living Guru. Many of his questioners challenge his assertion that dead Gurus cannot bring one to a realisation of the Self. Because of this it will be helpful tp explain the reasoning behind his statements. The Guru, is not a person, he is the impersonal Self; he is the power of the Self manifesting through a human body, not the body itself or anything in it. while that body is alive the grace of the Self is channelled through it to the devotees. When the body dies the Self can no longer use it to transmit grace. After death the Guru remains as he always was, that is, the unmanifest and formless Self. Because the Guru has no form after death of the physical body, it is not then possible for a devotee to get his grace by concentrating on a picture or a mental image of him. This is because the 'him' no longer exists. As Sri Ramana says, such practices are only good for concentration.
If one concentrates on, and has devotion towrds, a dead Guru, then grace will come from the unmanifest Self (this too happens for matured Souls), and not from the form of the Guru. This grace can take one to an effortless thought free state, but it cannot pull tht mind into the Self and destroy it.The above messages clearly state the need for a living human Guru. The messages are not to offend anyone. It is only an awareness kind of stuff and messages from Ramana and his devotee.
Saturday, June 21, 2008
Friday, June 20, 2008
Central Teachings
- Self Enquiry (Who am I?)
Remove all thougths by negating you are not the body, the sense organs, the bundle of thoughts and finally you will find yourself devoid of thoughts after continuous practise. Hold on to the "I" thought (kind of ray of light, not a mental thought or word though) and trace its source. It will reach the Heart where your soul resides. Only this much one can do. This is the state of a yogi. When the mind is mature the Self destroys the mind and Self realization occurs, the state of a Jnani.
- Self surrender
You submit all your ego to Self or Guru. The love of the Self finally destroys the mind and Self realization occurs.
Both the teachings finally teach us what Love is and the importance of Love and that we are nothing but Love. God is Love - Love is God!!!
Remove all thougths by negating you are not the body, the sense organs, the bundle of thoughts and finally you will find yourself devoid of thoughts after continuous practise. Hold on to the "I" thought (kind of ray of light, not a mental thought or word though) and trace its source. It will reach the Heart where your soul resides. Only this much one can do. This is the state of a yogi. When the mind is mature the Self destroys the mind and Self realization occurs, the state of a Jnani.
- Self surrender
You submit all your ego to Self or Guru. The love of the Self finally destroys the mind and Self realization occurs.
Both the teachings finally teach us what Love is and the importance of Love and that we are nothing but Love. God is Love - Love is God!!!
Madurai to Tiruvannamalai
Sri Ramana left Madurai when He was merely seventeen after a strange death experience. This experience brought self realization and upon call from Arunachala, He arrived Tiruvannamalai and spent the rest of his life in Tiruvannamalai.
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